A Quick Update

Hello AverateMedia people!

I think it's important that you know two things:
1) I've returned to Arbirator's ROBLOX Blog
2) I have also returned to school.

I apologize for the lack of posts; but now that summer has ended, it's slowing down.

I'll talk more soon; but for now, nothing else to say.
Thanks.

- Darwin12

The AverateMedia Catchup #1 [waiting a few days]

Writers Note:

This is a new thing we're gonna do weekly now!

___________________________________________________

Welcome to The AverateMedia Catchup Number One.

It's been way more than a week; but let me catch you up on this week at AverateMedia, as well as some other interesting numbers and articles that didn't make the cut!

Articles this Week [well, more than a week ._.]:

On 8/6/13, we had an interview with BaseballlYankees, a Kestrel Board Member! We talked about KestCon, Kestrel, her job, and more!

The next day, An Evening with Rat458 of Ireland was a thirty minute interview crunched down into one blog post about the Prime Minister of the Ireland Group! [read now] The same day, I posted that I had been selected as an intern for ROBLOX News; but this wouldn't stop my activity! We also welcomed two new members to AverateMedia: nicolas411 and pinapley.

Part One and Part Two of Darwin12's opinion article, "Some of ROBLOX's Best Designed Places" came out on 8/8/13 and 8/10/13, respectfully lining seven of ROBLOX's most advanced and well designed places!

Darwin12 also had words with Sci-Fi artist and creative mastermind, xcalibur about his game "The Digital Sea" which you may read by clicking here!

Darwin12 on ROBLOX News!
After being on ROBLOX News for two weeks; it proved to be trouble for Darwin12, lack of communication as he withdrew from the RN team and immediately took his work with him for posting on AM this past week!

Top Commenters?:
You may have noticed a new widget on our page lists the top commenters on our posts! We want reasonable and decent comments of course; but if you do comment, you will likely get on the Top Ten of commenters! So do that now! :)

As We Grow:
These past weeks alone, a grand total of four hundred viewers have seen and read the blog uniquely from tens of countries. 55% of the viewers are from the United States, 33% are from Canada, 16% are from the United Kingdom, and the rest left over are people from Russia,  The Netherlands, Egypt and almost ten other countries.

We look forward to entertaining hundreds and even thousands more as the year and time progresses.

Finally, if you are interested in getting up to the minute feed updates from our blog directly delivered to your email or another reader you use, click here and see your options!

As a sort of off-topic thing this week: people in love with gaming in general will find home at Averate's upcoming projects across the internet! Stay tuned to our Twitter, @Averate for not only ROBLOX news, but even more types of news!

That concludes this week's "The AverateMedia Catchup #1"

Compound: An Excellent FPS by Samaxis

The work of Samaxis, a ROBLOX EBR member & all-around talented curator is never a surprise to me or tens of thousands of others.

One of his older projects titled "Compound" is a high quality FPS. Using the Tabby framework written by Rudimentality Development, Compound is the closest you can get to realistic FPS gaming. It's very rare that I find an exceptionally designed FPS game that not only has good weapons and good gameplay, but a great map. Samaxis finds a great way to pull this off with his flawlessly designed map.

To add to the realism, there is a lens flare when you look at the sun!

Samaxis calls this game "your standard run-and-gun shooter" in the description, but in retrospect, the game is much more than that. While there is no set goals, and no evident story. The gameplay is infinite. With friends, you could play for hours in this nearly tangible map and not even know it [source: playing it for almost two hours and not evening knowing it] and it doesn't stop there.

The map is huge. From several floors in ruined buildings, ladders, underground walkways, a shipping and storage area, and tens of other secluded and hidden areas, the game experience is expanded and there are infinite places to run, hide, or fight in this map.

Set aside the map's great size, an extensive amount of hiding and secluded areas, the map boasts a serious amount of detail. Ruined walls, buildings, and even the terrain is elaborate and looks thorough everywhere on the map. You can even see the great work done on the lens flare, the wood and the archways, tunnels, and even a ruined bus. Everything about this map is fresh, new and unique and it is not only a great place to play in, but a great place to look around in and explore.

Check it out for yourself.

- Darwin12

Icarus International Airport: "Futur-istic"

Hello guys, Nicolas411 here.

The front of Icarus International, notice the
 colorful and dynamically-lit truss beams.

Most airports usually found on ROBLOX are...well, lacking in a modern design. For some of them, it looks good in a semi-classic style. But Icarus International Airport, built by AverateMedia's very own Darwin12, is very futuristic. First off, most airports do not include the awesome underground arrival area, which Icarus pioneers. Also, It will be including a tram system, which goes underground, underneath the taxiways and the runway, to another terminal. Darwin is making another terminal due to the high demand of people wanting a base at Icarus. Which, I understand, because Icarus is so awesome. I will talk more about this second terminal in the future.

Icarus International is still work in progress, hopefully finished soon. It will be a hub for Darwin's airline, airFinale. Also, it will be a focus airport for one of ROBLOX's largest and oldest airlines, RoAir. It is also home to several other airlines. I would give Icarus a 10/10, due to the amazing and futuristic build style Darwin has used and because he doesn't abandon a project, he keeps on moving with it. Good luck finishing up Icarus, Darwin.

Hope you enjoyed, thank you for reading.

NICOLAS411

         ~





As a side note from Darwin12 [me], I didn't really expect for one of my writers to actually write about my actual airport/place, so I appreciate that they did that.

As other news, we have more posts coming soon in the coming days that are about multiple topics ;)
Thanks

- Darwin12
/ Founder & Editor of AverateMedia

xcalibur & The Digital Sea: Where Beauty and Art Clash

XCalibur, otherwise known as "Phearo", the creator of an ambitious sci-fi map named "The Digital Sea", is an interesting person, builder and creative mind. Today, we look at "The Digital Sea", as well as it's numerous great points of exclusive design, and abstract game positions.

The game is dynamic and original in the fact that you spawn in a broken-tile room with no exit. Only windows of the ensuing surroundings of the map. I found this interesting and highly clever; as it gave a lot of detail to see, as well as a great way to keep all the players of the game in one location. If I could state what this room is: I would say it is a futuristic room that aged a bit. The game? Clearly a scenic game: something worth showing off, but other than that, there is no obvious storyline to what is going on.

Set aside being an excellent artist, an inspired person from the game "Deus Ex", and a DeviantArt photo, he is an excellent designer on ROBLOX.

I had the chance to sit down and talk with Xcalibur about the game.
"The dynamic lights update when it first released really made me think "This would look amazing with neon lights." "Certainly it does, the game also demonstrates an excellent use of dynamic lighting in the various aspects of the game."

"Yup, high contrast places really pop out with the new update."

Xcalibur has been playing since March 2008, Pi Day, to be exact. He is a part of numerous sci-fi projects besides his finished work demonstrated in this blog.

"Well, right now, I've been attempting to create a place that's bigger and more explorable than The Digital Sea. Something with a mix of both fantasy and modern architecture, though still having that sense of surrealness. But, everything is still just on paper, so the idea may do a complete 180 in the long run."

We look forward to seeing what he has next to come after this creative endeavor called: "The Digital Sea."

See it for yourself.

Introducing Some of Our Newest AverateMedia Members!

Hello everyone!

Here at AverateMedia, we received some extensive amounts of requests for jobs! We hired [so far] two people that we think fit our category of work and will be making blog posts!

Below are the bios and summaries of these people!

Nicolas411:
Hello guys,
I am Nicolas411, an editor/writer for AverateMedia. Since I accidently missed the deadline to submit my bio, I have to make it up by posting this. Some thing about me:
-I am 11 years old (May seem pretty young, I know, but I am NOT to be under estimated)
-I joined ROBLOX on January the 11th, 2009. I was 6 1/2 or 7 at the time.
-I love aviation and the whole aspect of flying. I have Flight Simulator X, in which I always use to fly for my virtual airline. (Link to my logbook, if you want to see my records)
-I hope to become a pilot when I am older, for Delta Airlines.
-I like to study history, and aviation.
I believe that is all to say. Thank you.

8DJake8D:
Hello. My name is Jake, but my ROBLOX username is 8DJake8D!

I like to write stories and other stuff.
I am 16; my birthday is in September!
I am experienced with blogging and I am very kind!

See you on ROBLOX & in future posts!

- 8DJake8D

That's all there is to say!
Look out for posts in a few days by them and a new one tomorrow!

Thanks!

The Citadel: A Sci-Fi Experience like No Other

One of the future shops in The Citadel marketplace!

The Citadel, a majestic Sci-Fi experience by ROBLOX user SerpentNebula was featured in my "Top Seven Best Designed Places," which I was a personal fan and had a deep love for the creativity and overwhelming tangibility of such a game. The experience was great, and not long after I did the "Top Seven," I took to The Citadel for exploration and a few interviews with C-SEC, The Citadel's own security enforcement, and would get a tour from an ally of C-SEC!

A view of the Citadel's exclusive and partially off-limits area.

 First impressions from entering were obvious: an absolute sensory spectacular is what lay around me. I turned the camera and caught each and every angle of it. I admired the detail, the people here, and of course the windows, doors, and custom decals. I also noticed an absolutely great use for dynamic lighting in the almost neon signs in the marketplaces and other places in The Citadel.

I had the opportunity to purchase a flying car in the game!

I had the time while I visited the place to interview a few people, UberJNemeis007 was one of the few I had the time to talk to!

We were inside a store that sold flying cars, which was guarded by the police and overwatching C-SEC and Blue Sun when I got the opportunity to talk with him.

"My job is working for the Blue Suns; a merc. group. Guns for hire. They prefer protecting citizens from danger. We rival against the abusive Eclipse."

I asked him a little bit about the average day here. I heard about riots and crazy crowds of civilians and criminals that would break into areas that were: "off-limits".

The traffic out the window moves!

"No sir, this is the only major riot we've had this month. Daily, everything is fine. This group isn't really even more than a month old; yet it grew quite big."

I mentioned myself featuring the place on my "Top Seven" a few days back.

"Have you seen the traffic?"

I answered that it was really something. People that aren't familiar with the traffic; he is referring to the flying cars. An absolutely wonderful feature of this place is a perfect use of decals to make an almost gif-like movement of flying cars out the windows of The Citadel.

A fellow Blue Sun member of Uber's came over and offered me an M7 gun. I accepted it on terms of security use.

One of the shots of C-SEC and Blue Sun securing the Motors Area!

I asked him about the rumored "floor five" that I had heard about. Suspiciously, he states nothing is on Floor Five, and that it is a C-SEC only area.

As I conclude the interview, he catches up to me and we talk a few more minutes about AverateMedia. Then I walk on to continue exploring the place. He came back a few minutes later and offered me a tour of The Citadel, a good ten to twenty minutes is what we spent looking around at the beautiful work and design as I took the pictures seen above, and admired the completely beautiful details put into it.

By the time the tour was over, I had known what I was writing about next, The Citadel: A Sci-Fi Experience Like No Other. People interested in The Citadel are seriously encouraged to go check it out; and if you want to help secure The Citadel and keep it safe, join C-SEC or Blue Sun!

The Citadel was a great Sci-Fi game, but it wasn't just the game that made it good. It was the design, the people that made it run, and the experience of it all that made it amazing.
- Darwin12

Some of ROBLOX's Best Designed Places: Part Two

This is a continuation of Part One of: "Some of ROBLOX's Best Designed Places," which was posted on 8/8/13! Check out Part One if you haven't already!

Part Two will wrap up the loose ends. The remaining three will be shown in style in this completion to the series!

ᶜᵒʳᵉᶫᶦᵍʰᵗ S³

By : Corecii

This absolutely breathtaking spectacular is a personal server of grand detail. The perfect place of mystery and exploration. With nearly 9000 bricks, it's a showstopper of creativity and detail. The work of Corecii and friends make this unexplainable and drifting world an exhilarating and incredible experience for Sci-Fi game fans and detail lovers alike.

See Corelight S3!

The Citadel

By : SerpentNebula
The Citadel is a mad Sci-Fi fan's dream.

Flying cars, a lovely terrace, skyways and stores, and recreation is what makes the Citadel an essential addition to the list. Not only does it have highly detailed textures and flying cars out the window, but it altogether nails the Sci-Fi scene down with a surreal experience while playing in the well lit creation by SerpentNebula.

Not only is it a great place to hang out, but it's also a place for a group! The C-SEC secures The Citadel all the time, handling invaders, problems, and more, while you have fun and explore it!

See The Citadel!

Subway Station

By : Tippee

The final addition to the list is Subway Station. I didn't provide a picture, but the highly detailed and shadow-dense creation is a marvel for any detail, train, or transportation lover. The game not only boasts realistic lighting, a wonderful color palette, and great design, but also houses a subway parked at the station to add to the theme.

See Subway Station!

All these games stack up equal in my mind for genius and creativity that is unprecedented and incomparable to many games. They stand out in the crowd, and made my selection simple and easy.

In Part One and Part Two, I looked for simply the best, and hands down, I believe that I found some of the best places in ROBLOX design.

May the creators be proud of what they built.
May the players be excited to explore these wonderful worlds.
And may these places continue to show thousands their greatness of design and beauty.

Have any places that you think should have been added? I may make an Edition Two in the future with seven more! Comment what you think should be included in Edition Two if I make it!

Thanks.
- Darwin12

Primary, Interview Requests, Community Articles & More!

I have a few more things to cover in terms of questions.

The OFFICIAL Averate Group can be found here!
http://www.roblox.com/My/Groups.aspx?gid=806149

- Interview Requests:
People have asked me: "What does it take to be interviewed?"
To be interviewed, you must qualify under one of these three categories:
- Have a place that we like or that has more than 30,000 visits,
- Have a group that the authors & editors like, or have more than 1000 members in the group,
- Qualify in some applicable matter of "Quality" leadership, construction, selling, etc. Whatever your profession is.

Request an interview by clicking here and sending a request!

- Community Articles
People have also asked me: "Can we submit editorials or community articles?"
Yes, submit them via email. If email isn't an option, click here, and tell us that in the PM.
Community Articles must be:
- Grammatically correct.
- Well written.
- Either an editorial or review.

- Place Review Requests
Another consistent question:
"WILL AVERATEMEDIA CHECK OUT MY PLACE AND REVIEW IT?"
We will check out ANY and ALL PLACES, but to be featured on the blog you must have:
- 10,000+ visits on the place,
- A game of decent quality
- We aren't looking for a Free Model Hub. If you use one, that's fine. Use twenty, and you're wasting our time.
Request a place by clicking here and sending a request!

- Join the ROBLOX group!
Up to the minute updates on our Twitter and on ROBLOX!
http://www.roblox.com/My/Groups.aspx?gid=806149

- Any Other Major Questions?
Any other questions may be PMed to Darwin12 or Averate.

Thanks again!

Some of ROBLOX's Best Designed Places: Part One

There is designing geniuses all over the ROBLOX platform, young and old, places both old and new, but today, I want to peel back the cover on Seven excellent games that I believe are some of the best designed places.

When I define design, I define not just detail, but it's look. In great design, I see genius. I want to see something new, and something surreal. Something that isn't the "everyday norm" for places and their look.

This is Part One, which will feature a few of the seven places and Part Two will be posted on 8/10/13!

Starlight Theatre

by : futuristicpopcorn

An extraordinary starter to the collection is by far one of the most advanced theatres I have seen.

 Futuristicpopcorn's creative theatre under the stars and next to moonlight is an excellent example of design in a modern era of ROBLOX's serious builders. The place carries almost 2000 people's visits ontop of itself, and set aside being an excellent looking theatre, it also shows a massive showstopping show and control suite from it's locked control room. Everything about this theatre is creative and the design set aside being original and new is also an evolving and incredible place to house your own minor shows with friends and in general a great place to be.

See Starlight Theatre!

Kerrus

by : leeruby

Fresh off it's recent featurette in the ROBLOX Development Journal, Kerrus is a sight for sore eyes.

A more than beautiful design with a variety of color palettes and a relaxing selection of lighting and well created GUIs makes this game what it was all said to be.

Kerrus doesn't just happen to be a wonderfully detailed place, but it's also extensively fast and it's lower brickcount makes lag almost impossible for most computers. It stacks up as one of the best Sci-Fi experiences I've seen in the game, and is by far one of the most promising realistic ROBLOX creations of living in space.

See Kerrus!

Krileos.

by : dreapster

The city of the future towers above me.

Another well designed city of the future. Flying ships and cars as well as towering buildings and extensive connections across it. The city, home to 23 billion individuals and tens of races is the work of user dreapster. Who made this extensive city not only big, but a grand exploration map. End to end, the city of the future is massive. It towers not only into the sky, but in width, it is breathtaking. A good ten minutes is what it takes to get from one end of the city to the other, and trying to reach the top of the world is nearly impossible. It is surely one of the most amazing designs I've seen in the four years I've played ROBLOX; and is certainly worth the time to take in the amazing structures that are around me and over me.

See Krileos.

Metro 2025

by : Zusik

Metro 2025 and it's nearly 22,000 bricks can't just be summed up in words more than it can the pictures.
I visited this place before it was a heavily blogged place, the place was just a metro entry more than it was a park and recreational area, but since then, the world has expanded and hasn't failed to impress me anymore than it was impressing me before.
The work of Zusik makes this all-around sensory spectacular the true metro of the future. Created with extensive and precise details, it can lag minor computers easily, but is a sight for eyes of all kinds.

See Metro 2025.

That concludes the first part of my "Some of ROBLOX's Best Designed Places" I will finish up the remaining of the seven in Part Two, which will release on the tenth!

Thanks for reading!
- Darwin12

Quick Update [About ROBLOX News]

Okay, everyone.
If you didn't hear already, I applied for arbirator's ROBLOX blog, and I recently was honored to be a summer intern on the blog.

I will continue writing my blog posts here daily with the help of my new editor: Pinapley and one of my new writers/editors, Nicolas411  and potentially some other writers in the coming days and weeks; I plan to release a blog post on arbirator's blog exclusively by the week.

Take note:
- This does not mean I am abandoning AverateMedia
- I will not slow my activity on AverateMedia
- Gaming Journalism is a big deal to me.

You can read the final role call for the interns here.

Another thing to say:
I have posts going to auto-publish this week, featuring a "Top Favorite Detailed Places" as well as a Game Spotlight on one of my FAVORITE Sci-Fi experience games.

Thanks to all 100 people that also have viewed this page so far. The numbers will rise, and I hope that I am providing [along with in the future -others-] good quality articles.

- Darwin12

An Evening with Rat458 of Ireland...

One of the few sightseeing locations in Dublin right now!

ROBLOX is full of activity, fun, and of course, what people consider to be the greatest: countries. ROBLOXian Countries are a huge deal in this day in age, with hundreds of them ranging from versions of the USA in ROBLOX, all the way to exotic and unheard of countries, such as The Republic of Rizal. But today, I take the time to sit down for an evening with the Prime Minister of what has become one of ROBLOX's most recognized countries. That is Ireland! Ireland owned by ThatCoolGuy14 was established earlier this year. With the opportunity of interviewing the Prime Minister of the great country, I took the time to ask a few questions about Ireland as a country now, in the future, and it's private companies, reforms and new Dublin. Below is the interview I conducted with Prime Minister of Ireland, Rat458!

Q: Thanks for giving me the opportunity to sit down with you for an evening and talk with you!

Rat458: No problem.

Q: Now as a starter, I am aware that you are the Prime Minister of ROBLOX's original Ireland group. I am aware that you also are head of Kestrel's board; but this interview is more about the Ireland Country; so I'll try to keep a cap on Kestrel talk... anything else I missed in terms of your jobs?

Rat458: Well, i'm High Rank in other groups, but those are my primaries.

Q: Now tell me a bit about Ireland. How long have you been in Ireland?

Rat458: Lets see.. well, I was the first citizen to join, so really the day that it was open. So I would say a good couple months.

Q: Okay, and how long have you been Prime Minister?

Rat458: A week.

Q: Oh, so it's like a new job?

Rat458: Well, yes. I was the Deputy Prime Minister for quite awhile. But yes, it's a fairly new job.

Q: Oh, I see. So with government in mind, what do you think of Ireland's now?

Rat458: Well, it's more stable than it was, I think we still have some challenges ahead. But were going to take care of them when the time comes.

Q: Now, I see Ireland has quite an interesting line-up of allies. Your country is a member of the EU and I am to believe your President actually is also the leader of that?

Rat458: He was, but in-fact, he just like quit. Like literally a few minutes ago. Now CommanderMillard will apparently lead it.

Q: So what do you think will happen to it?

Rat458: Well, knowing commander for a long time I know he is a good man, smart and the EU will do fine with him leading.

Q: Well, set aside Ireland's faults, it's future seems promising. There is talk of Ireland's own private sector evolving and involving companies such as: Kestrel, Tiger, airFinale, and tens of other businesses in the new Dublin that is being built?

Rat458: Yes, I've recently visited the new Dublin. Well, what is completed at least of it. So far, there is the new Kestrel store which is custom for Dublin made by mymaddog [now ThatCoolGuy14] along with the Tiger store which is also at the current Dublin.

Q: So I guess one could say that Ireland is the fashion hub of the world right now with all these brands?

Rat458: I suppose. Oh, not to forget the new Dublin has a Kiwi store as well.

Q: Then that's quite definite, isn't it?

Rat458: Indeed.

Q: So, it's quite clear that you are looking forward to Ireland's future. I cannot wait for the new Dublin; maybe another blog post when it comes out!

Rat458: Any time, I'm highly awaiting the arrival of the new Dublin. Just another step to becoming a true ROBLOXian superpower.

Rat458, the Prime Minister of Ireland was quite an interesting person to interview, and set aside his interview, I had the time to partially explore the extensive land of their present Dublin which I suggest you check out by clicking here and going to see it for yourself and people who are in love with the city and the country are suggested also to check out the group and become a citizen today!

That concludes this interview with Prime Minister of Ireland, rat458! Rat and I have planned for an interview with him and other government officials when the new Dublin releases, so stay posted for that blog post as well!

- Darwin12

An Interview with Baseballsyankees, Kestrel Board Member!

Hello readers!

Today's interview is with one of Kestrel's Board of Directors, Baseballlyankees!

For those of you unfamiliar with Baseball,

A snapshot of the new Kestrel Homestore!

she works for Kestrel, one of ROBLOX's most elite clothing businesses ever. With it's thousands of raving fans and customers looking for quality clothing, they come to Kestrel; at a high price, I took to find out a little more about the buzzing fashion icon of ROBLOX as a business and what people think of it. In order to do so, I contacted some Kestrel highranks for interviews, one of them that responded to my call was Baseballlyankees, a present board member at the Kestrel company!

I had the opportunity to ask him questions about KestCon, their own online convention, his job in Kestrel and what he looks forward to for the future and the now which is talked about in the interview below!

Q: What is your primary job at Kestrel besides being a Board Member?

BaseballlYankee's Outfit in August 2013!

BaseballlYankees: There are two jobs I have. Both are primary, Like I said, i'm in charge of Global Agents as well as customer service.

Q: So in a normal day, do you allocate a lot of work time to Kestrel, or is it usually just time you have left over in general?

BaseballlYankees: When i'm on I work, non busy days or times. I take like 10 minute breaks, but that depends on the day.

Q: So in a normal day, do you allocate a lot of work time to Kestrel, or is it usually just time you have left over in general?

BaseballlYankees: When i'm on I work, non busy days or times. I take like 10 minute breaks, but that depends on the day. It's mostly hard working with these global agents.

Q: So at Kestrel, you have a lot planned for the future, what is something you are excited about?

BaseballlYankees: I'm excited about many things. Meeting customers, going to KestCON, helping out people, charity works we will be doing soon and many more things.

Q: I haven't heard a whole lot about KestCON, can you tell the readers a little bit about it?

BaseballlYankees: We are still building everything and prepping [at the time of this post] KestCON is a convention held on ROBLOX to help bring many of our buyers and customers together.

Q: So in a normal day, do you allocate a lot of work time to Kestrel, or is it usually just time you have left over in general?

BaseballlYankees: When i'm on I work, non busy days or times. I take like 10 minute breaks, but that depends on the day.

Q: Anything else we should know?

BaseballlYankees: Something that a lot of people don't know is that many famous ROBLOXians will be there, but you all will have to wait and see who they are.

Q: Sounds very exciting. I have one more question for you.

BaseballlYankees: Ok.

Q: What is your present take on the fashion industry and your competitors? To name a few; Tiger, Kiwi,
Uniqlo *if that qualifies* and RoFashion?

BaseballlYankees: Our fashion is growing much but there are many copiers of our company [Kestrel]. I'm not being rude but, most of them are copiers of us because we are technically the first fashion company. But nothing I can do about it, because it is what it is and we need to do the best to get to the top.
Thank you for having me.

Q: No, thank you for this time to talk to you! Have a nice day!

BaseballlYankees: You too!

This interview is one of many that I have planned with Kestrel to analyze the company and see more about it in general! So look out in the future for new interviews with Kestrel staff and people similarly!